Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloader

Discussion in 'Black Powder' started by elderberry99, Aug 18, 2006.

  1. elderberry99

    elderberry99 Well-Known Member

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    I am looking to get a jump on the Whitetail season with a muzzleloader. I have it down to the two models listed. I do want to get a synthetic stock and stainless barrel. I guess that is the way to go.
    I have shouldered both models at Gander Mountain and both feel about the same.
    Is there one better then the other, and why?
    Is the stainless barrel woth the extra money versus the blued barrel?
    My shots will be around 60 to no more then about 100 yards, and it will be a .50 caliber I will use.
    Any help would be greatly appreciated. This is the first for me in Muzzleloading.
     
  2. 8pointduck

    8pointduck Super Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    Elder,I can't say enuogh good things about Thompson. This is a very good and accurate gun.I think Remington is not making a good effort to replace there 700 ml.
     

  3. elderberry99

    elderberry99 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    8pointduck,
    Thank you. I have been looking at both of these muzzleloaders but do not have any experience with black powder other then shooting a sidelock some years ago.
    My only concern with the T/C Omega is the drop action of the trigger assembly. I worry that opening and closing every time I go to prime will cause the trigger assembly to loosen after time and cause the trigger to just fall down on it's own.
    The Remington has the swing open block that seems to be pretty sturdy overall.
    Again, I have no experience with either one of these and only played with them at Gander Mountain. If you have ever been to Gander, you will know that there is a tether attached to all their firearms as so you cannot fire them while on the rack or walk away with them. Unfortunately, you cannot work the action on some of them either due to the security system that GM has attached at the trigger.
    Any other information I can obtain would be greatly appreciated.
     
  4. john1911

    john1911 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    I've used the T/C Omega for three years now. Excellent rifle.
    FWIW, I saw a blued black syn. stock Omega in Wal-Mart the other day for less than $350. It was clam packed w/ about everything you would need to get started (except powder).
    John
     
  5. elderberry99

    elderberry99 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    john1911,
    I saw the same Omega in my Wal-mart as well. They had two of them on the rack. It was the Z5 model.
    I am not sure if it is all that important to get the stainless barrel or not. I hear so much about how black powder is a corrosive, and how it will rust your barrel out on you.
     
  6. john1911

    john1911 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    I used a CVA with the a blued bbl before the Omega. Never had any problems w/ rust. I currently use Pyrodex 777 pellets, they're supposed to be less corrosive than regular black powder. I clean my rifle after each use and coat the bore and all metal w/ T/C Bore Butter.
    John
     
  7. elderberry99

    elderberry99 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    I called Thompson Center and talked to a repair tech yesterday about the difference between the Omega Z5 and other Omegas. He tells me no difference at all. He also tells me to just go with the Z5 that they have at Walmart with all the stuff to get you going right away. He says it is a real good deal and just not to worry about the stainless steel barrel because it will all rust if you don't take care of them they way they recommend.
     
  8. john1911

    john1911 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    Just checked the Cabela's site, the Z5 is just the basic blue/syn Omega (I guess). Probably added the "Z5" to make people think it was new and improved.
    That is a pretty good deal at Wallyworld.
    John
     
  9. elderberry99

    elderberry99 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    Now this is straight from the tech at Omega. He tells me the only difference between the Omegas other then the obvious like stainless, laminant, etc., is that the Z5 has "Z5" stamped on the barrel.
    He had to chuckle when he told me that too!
     
  10. john1911

    john1911 Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    shot my Omega today (just got back and got her cleaned up). I managed to get a 1" center to center group at about 75 yards. I was using the factory front sight and a William's receiver sight. Pretty good shooting for me. I think the Omega would be the way to go.
    John
     
  11. AveragEd

    AveragEd Well-Known Member

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    re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    I fell for the "Z5 really doesn't mean anything" and bought one. When reading the owner's manual, I couldn't help but wonder why a stainless steel rifle would need a "WeatherShield" coating and called T/C. At first, I got the standard "the only difference is that the Z5 doesn't have a fluted barrel" answer but after I repeatedly asked why a stainless rifle needs the "WeatherShield" coating and how can a rifle with a coating can sell for hundreds less than one without it, the person finally admitted that the Z5 is carbon steel and the coating gives the exterior the rust resistance of stainless. The bore, of course, does not benefit from that coating. Fortunately, the shop where I bought the rifle exchanged it for a stainless Omega.

    For a good (or bad, depending upon your perspective) comparison of most of the popular inlines, go to http://www.chuckhawks.com/rating_muzzleloading_manufacturers.htm. That entire website is a wealth of muzzleloading knowledge and you can spend hours reading the various articles there and learning from them.

    I found Triple Se7en pellets to be more accurate in my Omega. A 150-grain equivalent load (three pellets) of Pyrodex shot three Hornady SST bullets in their stemmed sabots into about 2-1/2 inches at 100 yards but the same load of Triple Se7en shot into 1.3" with a 3-9x Leupold scope. I then tried three of the sample T/C ShockWave bullets and sabots that came with the Omega with Triple Se7en but the accuracy was not nearly as good as the Hornady SSTs.

    Average velocity for those three-shot strings over my chronograph was 2,190 FPS for the Pyrodex load and 2,130 for the Triple Se7en load (with either bullet).

    Ed
     
  12. buckaroo50

    buckaroo50 New Member

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    Re: Remington Genesis Muzzleloader vs. T/C Omega muzzleloade

    I know this is an old post but someone may find it useful..

    The Remington Genesis was made by Traditions.. I am not a Traditions or a CVA fan for various reasons.. one being safety... I will leave it at that so that it doesn't start a lot of bickering.. A little research and you can easily find out what I am talking about.

    All T/C, Knight, Savage, LHR, Green Mountain barrels are magnafluxed and shot peened, can't say the same for CVA Bergera or Traditions barrels...

    To the best of my knowledge the difference between the Omega and the Omega Z-5 is that the Omega has better sights and the pin for the drop block trigger assembly is a screw and the Z-5 is a pressed in pin and lastly the clean up of machined work is more on the Omega (not going to see it anyway)..

    Here are a few tips for Omega and Omega Z-5 owners that may help...

    To increase accuracy - free float the barrel so that you can run a couple pieces of paper between the barrel and the stock. (a wood dowel and sandpaper on the inside of the stock can free it up)...
    To increase accuracy - loosed the two screws that hold the stock on and tighten the back one first (closest to the butt) and the front one last (closest to the muzzle), and the front one not quite as tight as the back one. (All barrels whip when fired and you don't want any pressure points with the barrel and stock)... Unless you want to mess around with accuracy blocks, which can be done with a 1" wide piece of milk carton slid up and down at various setting to see if that helps accuracy.. Chances are that will not be needed because the floated barrel should do just fine...

    I like to somewhat break in my barrels.. Some people just go out and work up an accuracy load... That is ok too, for them...

    When breaking in a ML barrel I use full bore Buffalo Ball-ET's 245 grain lead (non-sabot) that have a hollow base for expansion.. I shoot 10 with 40 grains of powder then wire brush and swap between each shot and allow 3-5 minutes for the barrel to cool (total time is about an hour for the ten shots) - the firing and cooling down also helps your barrel, just the same as driving a new car at different speeds for the first few hundred miles, speed it up cool it down, speed it up, cool it down etc.

    Go home and wire brush and thoroughly clean the ML... Next day is the same with 50 grains of powder, next day 60 grains, then 70 grains, then 80 grains.. Once this is done then any snaking or stretching of the rifling should be minimized a little and the barrel is well on its way to be broke in and any minor milling imperfections will be smoothed out somewhat too. Probably no need to lap the barrel if it starts to shoot good groups with what ever bullet and powder combination you choose... All this really doesn't take much time and it is fun to do and the Buffalo Ball-ET's are dirt cheap...

    Money can't buy happiness but owning a ML is a good start...